Since then, she has pivoted and become a Pilates instructor who loves working with creatives to help them relieve the pain she knows all too well.
But as we discussed in this episode, the marketing of both is essentially the same. So in today’s podcast, you’ll learn not only how to alleviate some of your real pain, but also how the tools from Simplest Marketing Plan work no matter what service you’re offering.
So here’s the baby step Andrea suggested.
If you want to alleviate the pain when working at the computer, take 5 minutes, step away from the computer, stand tall, lift your arms above your head, feel your feet on the ground and just breathe while you stretch. (For more, get the free video on her web site.)
Listen here and below (or scroll down to read the transcript).
And if you like what you hear, we’d love it if you write a review, subscribe on Apple Podcasts and sign up for Quick Tips from Marketing Mentor.
Transcript of Marketing Mentor Podcast Episode #448 with Andrea Brody
ilise benun
If you've been following me for at least a year, you probably know that I like to use my birthday as a marketing tool, which means a birthday sale in the Marketing-Mentor shop. Well, it's that time again. And if you're listening to this between June 24th and June 30th of 2022, you are in luck. Hop on over to marketing-mentor.com, and click on the shop to see all the deals we have, not only on the Simplest Marketing Plan but also on the proposal bundles, pricing bundles and more. Now, onto this week's episode.
So, hi there, this is ilise benun, your Marketing Mentor. And this is the podcast for you if, and only if, you are ready to leave the feast or famine syndrome behind, and I mean for good.
I talk a lot about finding your client's pain points. And I'm talking mostly about figurative pain, like too much to do and not enough time. But in today's episode, I talked with Andrea Brody, who's a former graphic designer who had actual back pain and neck pain from sitting too much at the computer and stressing over her design projects. And she has since pivoted and become a Pilates instructor who loves working with creatives to help them relieve the pain she knows all too well. But, as we discussed in this episode, the marketing of both is essentially the same. So, in today's podcast, you'll learn not only how to alleviate some of your real pain, but also how the tools from the Simplest Marketing Plan work, no matter what service you're offering. So, listen and learn.
ilise benun
Hello Andrea, welcome to the podcast.
Andrea Brody
Thank you so much. I'm so happy to be here, ilise. Thanks for having me.
ilise benun
You're welcome. And it was you who initiated this, so thank you for reaching out to me after all these years. And please begin, as I always do, with introducing yourself.
Andrea Brody
Well, ilise, we actually met in 2004. I was a graphic designer at that time, working in the corporate world. And I left to go solo and I needed help setting up all my marketing tools. And you were such a great help to me. I actually still use all those tools today, in my business, which is as a Pilates instructor.
When I was a graphic designer, I suffered from a lot of neck, shoulder and back pain, and that's how I ended up finding Pilates—which is what I'm doing today, so I can help people like myself who sit at the desk all day and are dealing with that pain from sitting and have that chronic pain like I had. So now I help people get stronger and alleviate stress in their bodies and minds with Pilates so that they can live balanced lives.
ilise benun
Beautiful. And I love, of course, the fact that even though you made a shift, you're still using the marketing tools and strategies that you learned because, truthfully, they do apply to almost anything, or at least any service. And so tell us a little bit about what Pilates is. Let's not assume people know because I don't even know if I know.
Andrea Brody
It's a system of exercises that helps with your posture, your strength and your flexibility. But it actually just is good for anyone, all levels and abilities. And it just helps you move through life better. So you can start at any age. I actually have a client that's 90 years old who joined in her 80s. And I see her twice a week and it's just remarkable. So you can start at any stage of life, any abilities. It just works wherever you're at.
And when I started, I was in so much pain from working at my desk all day. I am right-handed. I was working on my design projects. And I had all these deadlines. I felt like I couldn't get away from my desk. And my shoulder and my neck were in constant pain. And I would go to Pilates every day and I would leave and I just felt so much relief because I felt taller, stronger, more stretched out and lifted out of my body, and I just moved better. And it helped me be more efficient in my work and how I moved in my body in all of my other activities.
ilise benun
Interesting. And just to maybe put it in a little context also, is it similar to yoga, different from yoga, totally different?
Andrea Brody
That's a common question that a lot of people ask. And Joseph Pilates, who developed Pilates, he got inspired from yoga. Yoga came way before Pilates, so he was inspired by it. So, it has some elements from it, but it's much different from that.
There's a lot of equipment that's used in it, where there are springs in the equipment where you use your body's own resistance to move the apparatus with the springs. Different from yoga in that aspect, in you're using your full body against the resistance of the springs when you're using the equipment.
And there's also an aspect of stretch and strength to every exercise and they build upon each other. It really works on the focus of your foundation, of your strength being in your center, your core, and everything else kind of stemming out from that. So when you have a strong foundation in your core, you can move from that and lift out of that, and that develops your posture and your ability to move and be stronger in all of your other activities. And it helps with your balance, and your flexibility, and your overall strength.
ilise benun
So, it sounds like something that would be good, especially, I want to say “If,” but as, people are aging. Right? Because some of those things come in much handier—I'm speaking from personal experience now—as we get older, right?
Andrea Brody
You're absolutely correct. With the aging process, it's really great, because as you start to age, your bone density starts to decrease and it helps with that. And also with your balance—that's another thing that starts to lessen as you age. And your flexibility also decreases with age, so it's very good for that as well. And your strength. So, all of those components help with aging.
Another aspect not involved with aging, low-back pain and posture, which is common, especially now, everyone's sitting more. With Pilates, it helps so much with just getting you into the proper alignment in your body, breaking all of those repetitive patterns that we're doing with our bodies: with sitting, using our cell phones, having our head forward all the time, and leaning forward and our shoulders going forward. It's breaking those patterns and getting us back into a better postural alignment so that we can decrease things like low-back pain, sciatica, neck pain and shoulder pain.
ilise benun
So, let's just talk a little bit about the marketing of these two different things: the graphic design services and the Pilates. And I assume you do Pilates virtually, as well as in-person with people, right?
Andrea Brody
I do. Yes. Quite a lot virtually now, which is pretty amazing. And I love it. Works very well.
ilise benun
I'm sure. It expands the marketplace a bit.
Andrea Brody
Yes.
ilise benun
How were you marketing your design services? What tools were you using? And how did that work? Which of those are you also applying to the Pilates? And is there any difference in terms of how it works?
Andrea Brody
With the design business, I had my newsletter and a blog. And I would blog regularly and send out the newsletter regularly, as well. And those worked great, and those were tools that you helped me establish.
ilise benun
And let me just interrupt there and say, and this was very early on, right? I mean, if we connected in 2004, that's almost 20 years ago. And certainly there are more people blogging and doing email newsletters now than there were at that point. So, there wasn't a lot of, I don't even think, did we call it “content marketing” at that point?
Andrea Brody
We did not. No.
ilise benun
That's so funny. What else? And how is it working?
Andrea Brody
I also did guest blogging with the design business, as well. And that worked really well, too.
ilise benun
Where?
Andrea Brody
In the design business, I specialize in a nonprofit graphic design. So I would go out to that community and do guest posts in that area.
ilise benun
And did you do any, what I now call “targeted outreach”? I think perhaps at that point we were calling it “warm email prospecting.”
Andrea Brody
I did. And that worked very well. I got a couple of very amazing, long-term clients that way. And that is another tool I still use with the Pilates business as well.
ilise benun
Excellent. And again, this was before I had really codified, if you will, the framework that I now call “The Simplest Marketing Plan,” but I've been teaching these same tools pretty much for a long time. And so the third one, we've talked about targeted outreach, we've talked about content marketing, and the third one is strategic networking. Were you doing any networking for your graphic design business also?
Andrea Brody
Here and there I would email the targeted emails to businesses that I would want to reach out to. That was more for me. That would work best for me. And then I would set up a meeting, and then that would develop into a client relationship.
ilise benun
All right. And so, with the Pilates business, how does that translate in terms of what you're doing and how it works?
Andrea Brody
So I kind of adapted the same things I liked and use them now. The blogging. The newsletters, I still like and I think those definitely work. I have a list, still, for that business and that's going out twice a month. So I still do the newsletters and I really enjoy doing that. And that's been continuing the whole time. And that's really worked for me, because when the pandemic happened and things got quiet, that's a way that I reached out and I got people to come back and be virtual clients again. So that was a very good tool.
ilise benun
And how have you built that list? Are you saying it's a totally different, brand-new list than your graphic design email newsletter list? Or was there some overlap or crossover?
Andrea Brody
It's a new list and it's from current clients, other people that I've met through time that I've just added to the list that have come my way through Pilates.
ilise benun
And you're saying also that you have continued the one-on-one outreach. I'm curious about that. How does that translate? Is it for actual clients, or is it guest blogging, or other types of opportunities?
Andrea Brody
Yes, this is a little different. So this is how I do it for this business. I think of complementary-type businesses. For me, that's chiropractors, acupuncturists, possibly massage therapists that might be possible cross-referral-type opportunities.
I research and I look to see if they are similar, if we have similar values in how we work, and if they look like a good match for me, and then I will reach out to them through email to see if they would be interested in talking further. And then I've had a couple of great relationships that way, where we refer each other clients. So that's worked out very well.
ilise benun
Yeah. And that's something I don't really talk about enough, in my opinion, which is using the targeted outreach, especially, but the content marketing, as well, to not so much focus on the end, what we call “end-user clients,” but on possible referral sources and complementary services. So, I'm really glad that you are adapting it that way, because that is actually, I think, easier because it's a win-win for both. And there's no timing issue per se, because with the targeted outreach, often what is frustrating for people is that if you don't catch them in their moment of need, you don't hear from them and you don't know if it's a good fit. But with referral sources, there's no real moment of need, per se, there's just a possible relationship to develop over time. Do you see it that way?
Andrea Brody
Yes, I do. And I just, I really find that this way that I'm reaching out to this particular group is working well for me and we can also learn things from each other at the same time.
ilise benun
Interesting. So let's come back to the Pilates a little bit before we wrap up, because one thing I find interesting is when you introduced yourself, for example, you talked about how it's relevant to creative professionals who you know because you are one and you've been one, and you're speaking quite literally to the pain points of creative professionals. And I appreciate that. And so my question is, do you specialize in working with creatives because you understand their pain? Or is that one of a few different markets that you focus on?
Andrea Brody
It's one of a few different markets, but they're definitely my favorite market.
ilise benun
Why?
Andrea Brody
Because I've been there. I understand how it feels when you're sitting at your desk all day and you feel like you're chained to the desk and you can't leave, but then you're on a deadline and you're trying to come up with ideas, but your neck hurts and you're starting to get a headache, but you really have to finish something and you don't get up.
But I promise you, that if you don't get up, it's going to be worse because you're just not going to come up with the idea of doing it that way. It doesn't work. I've done that. And then I've gotten up and I've done Pilates, or I've gone for a walk, and I've felt so much better, and I've come up with the idea quicker. And it's been such a relief to me when I've taken that moment for myself and done that because I've been so much more productive and I've come up with such a better idea in a better amount of time than beating my head against the wall, sitting at the desk in pain.
Also, when you take care of yourself and take those moments for yourself, you are able to show up better for your clients so that you can come to them with confidence and handle their projects better, because they come to you with their stresses and pressures, and you need to be equipped to handle and respond to them, to make them feel confident in you. That's why you need to be able to take care of yourself, even if you feel like you don't have time.
ilise benun
Right. And prioritize it, which is very tricky for a lot of people. You're reminding me of a book I read and loved, recently, called The Extended Mind. I don't know if you've heard of it. But in it, one of the ways this author talks about extending the mind is with the body. And she talks about how, for some reason, and this is kind of my question for you, Andrea, is for some reason, we seem to believe that we have to sit at the desk—that that's where we think best. And she proposes, kind of like what you were saying, that we probably think better, especially if we're stressed or in pain, we think better when we're using our body, or when we get away from the screen, or we take a walk and do something different, thereby extending the mind. What are your thoughts about that?
Andrea Brody
I completely agree with it. And I would love to read that book, because that's exactly what I mean. Yes. And that's why even if someone feels like they don't have time, just take five minutes. Nothing's going to change in your project or in your world with five minutes. And once you learn you can take 5 minutes, you can take 15 minutes. You need to do that for yourself. And once you kind of start to do that, it'll get easier for you.
ilise benun
And that's probably a good segue to my last question, which is about a baby step. What baby step, if someone is going to take 5 minutes as a step toward 15 minutes, let's say, what is a baby step they can do very practically to begin moving toward better self-care?
Andrea Brody
Taking the five minutes, maybe schedule the five minutes, or set a timer for the five minutes, so that it's a non-negotiable five minutes. And then they get up and they leave the desk for five minutes.
ilise benun
No matter what.
Andrea Brody
No matter what. And they don't look at the phone, and they just go and be quiet somewhere, and they go outside and walk around for five minutes, or they stretch themselves for five minutes, do some gentle stretches.
ilise benun
Can you make a suggestion for a gentle stretch?
Andrea Brody
Yeah. I would stand up, and I would just raise my arms up to the ceiling and then just reach them down back to your hips and do that five times. Just reach up and stretch your whole body, and breathe out and reach them back down. So just so that you're lengthening your whole body. And just keep pressing your feet into the floor, because you've been sitting so much and everything's collapsing down. You want to touch your fingertips to the ceiling and then just take them back down. That's it!
ilise benun
Interesting. And one thought is, “That's it? Right? That can't be enough.”
Andrea Brody
It really doesn't have to be hard. Just get up and move. That's it.
ilise benun
I was thinking this morning, I like to do … I've never done Pilates, maybe once … and I started doing yoga again recently. And I've been doing a very fast walk around—I live in Savannah, so it's around Forsyth Park. I try to do it every day. And this morning when I was walking around the park, I thought, “I could do one more round. I could go around one more time.”
And then I thought, “No,” because if I push myself beyond what I know I have time for, then the mental gymnastics that I know myself I will do is, “Oh, I have to go around twice. I have to go around three times. Oh, I don't have time for that.” I always have time to go around once. And I really feel like, if I just go around once, every day, that cumulatively adds up. What do you think of that, I don't know, what would I call it … “self-talk”?
Andrea Brody
I don't mind that because you know what you can do. And I think everyone feels different every day. And one day, that might change for you, and you might go one-and-a-half times or do the full two times. And that will change, and then you'll be going two times every day. And every day, everybody's body feels different. And you have to honor how you feel and not push yourself, because then you won't want to do it anymore.
ilise benun
Exactly.
Andrea Brody
I agree with you. And that's why we're starting with that five-minute thing with everybody, right? So just start with that; honor what your body feels each day and go with that because you have to do what feels good to you or else you're not going to want to do it.
ilise benun
Exactly. Excellent. All right. Well, I think this has been really helpful. So Andrea, thank you for reaching out to me. And tell the people where they can find you. And if you have a special offer, please share it.
Andrea Brody
Yes. Thank you so much. Well, as I had mentioned, when I was doing my graphic design stuff, I had a lot of body aches and pains, and one was low-back pain. So I made a free video to help with it and it only takes the five minutes we were talking about. So if you go to my website, you'll be able to see my free video right away and sign up to get it. And it's at BrightlyBalanced.com.
ilise benun
Beautiful. All right. Well, thank you so much, Andrea, again. And we will be in touch.
Andrea Brody
Yes. Thank you so much. It was really great.
ilise benun
Isn't that amazing, how once you know how to use the marketing tools in the Simplest Marketing Plan, and you understand the big idea, you can adapt them to market any service and almost anything your client offers, too?
So, here's the baby step Andrea suggested. If you want to alleviate the pain you have when working at the screen or the computer, take five minutes, that's all. Step away from the computer, stand tall, lift your arms above your head, feel your feet on the ground, and just breathe while you stretch. Is that it? Yes. Actually that is it. And it's plenty. You'll be surprised. I know I was.
So, did you learn a little something? I hope so, because that's how this works. One breath and one baby step at a time. Before you know it, you'll have better clients with bigger budgets. Speaking of better clients, they're probably not going to fall in your lap. That's why I keep hawking my Simplest Marketing Plan. If you want to build a thriving business on your own terms, you need the 4.0 version for 2022. It is packed with all new content, including six new case studies and six new lessons. You'll also get three different planners, plus access to the free monthly Office Hours group coaching session where you'll meet other creative pros who are practicing what I preach and taking control over their business and their life. Find it all in the Marketing Mentor shop at marketing-mentor.com. I'll be back soon with more conversations with creative professionals who are doing what it takes to ditch the feast or famine syndrome. Until next time.